Jon, from across the water in the USA, was looking at my video clips from the post below (‘a breezy day’) and made some really useful observations. I love my navigator but as someone who still regards himself as a newbie to sailing, I do find getting the best out of her sails somewhat confusing at times. Jon sheds some excellent light/tips on the situation. Thanks Jon, I really appreciate the advice and time you gave my dilemma.
He noted that the bottom of the sail looked far too loose given the wind speeds on the day. He also observed
“When you are on the "wrong" tack, i.e. when the sail is on the windward side of the boom and laying against it, your sail is slipping up over the boom and hanging down on the other side. The foot should be tight enough so that it stays on the same side of the boom on that tack”
Now it’s been pointed out I can see exactly what he means – good spot!
Jon goes on to comment that when I tack, the foot of the sail is too loose, too full and so flogs a lot as I come into the wind; flogging slows the boat down and so makes it harder to get around!
“In the wind that you are sailing in, I think the main sail needs to be a lot flatter by tightening up the downhaul, outhaul, and what other adjustments there are for that particular plan. The flatter the sail, the less power it has, which is what you need when the wind is blowing”.
Now that all makes sense to me but here is my problem. I still haven’t got clear in my head which bits to tighten/loosen or move to actually get a flatter sail! I know I can slide the boom attachment up or down the mast;
I know there is some form of outhaul at the mast end of the boom which runs through blocks – which I can pull in or let out! But I’ll be darned if I can work out what changes as a result of doing those things. I really am quite a dim sailor aren’t I!!
On a good note, Jon reckons I have gybes buttoned down but just need to remember that
“as you come into a jibe, sheet in the main just before you turn through the wind so that the "thwack" of the boom is only allowed to move through a very small space. Once through, you have to immediately let out the main again”.
His final tip was something I had been wondering about but it now confirms my suspicions and is something I can alter almost immediately. Jon comments
“your mainsheet looks to me to be over-leveraged. Not that big of a deal, but you have a lot of rope running out to the end of your boom. I am running a gaff-rigged yawl on my Pathfinder, and I don't really know how that compares to your rig, but I have a very simple 2 to 1 (I think) block on the boom so there are only 2 ropes running out to my boom. On small boats like ours, you really don't need all that much help to pull in the main sail. The problem is that the mass of rope that we put up to make it easy can be a hindrance. Not only is it more stuff to tangle, but in light air, it really makes your mainsail unable to respond to a small breeze, the friction of the blocks is too much”.
I really appreciate Jon giving up his time. I have no idea where in the states he resides but it was kind to pass on the tips and advice.......so thanks Jon.....and if any navigator owners can steer me correctly on the business with the boom adjustments......I’d really appreciate it. I know people have given me advice in the past but I’m still confused. As a teacher I know that sometimes you have to tell or show some students the same things several times before they internalise it....and this is OK with me, for once they get it, they fly! I am one of these ‘late’ flyers!
Steve
He noted that the bottom of the sail looked far too loose given the wind speeds on the day. He also observed
“When you are on the "wrong" tack, i.e. when the sail is on the windward side of the boom and laying against it, your sail is slipping up over the boom and hanging down on the other side. The foot should be tight enough so that it stays on the same side of the boom on that tack”
Now it’s been pointed out I can see exactly what he means – good spot!
Jon goes on to comment that when I tack, the foot of the sail is too loose, too full and so flogs a lot as I come into the wind; flogging slows the boat down and so makes it harder to get around!
“In the wind that you are sailing in, I think the main sail needs to be a lot flatter by tightening up the downhaul, outhaul, and what other adjustments there are for that particular plan. The flatter the sail, the less power it has, which is what you need when the wind is blowing”.
Now that all makes sense to me but here is my problem. I still haven’t got clear in my head which bits to tighten/loosen or move to actually get a flatter sail! I know I can slide the boom attachment up or down the mast;
the two bits which confuse me still
a)the blue rope around the mast to which the boom attaches - it can be moved up or down - why? How does that affect the sail shape again?
b) the silver blocks with red/white rope through them - what does that do to boom? How does that alter sail shape and why?
On a good note, Jon reckons I have gybes buttoned down but just need to remember that
“as you come into a jibe, sheet in the main just before you turn through the wind so that the "thwack" of the boom is only allowed to move through a very small space. Once through, you have to immediately let out the main again”.
His final tip was something I had been wondering about but it now confirms my suspicions and is something I can alter almost immediately. Jon comments
“your mainsheet looks to me to be over-leveraged. Not that big of a deal, but you have a lot of rope running out to the end of your boom. I am running a gaff-rigged yawl on my Pathfinder, and I don't really know how that compares to your rig, but I have a very simple 2 to 1 (I think) block on the boom so there are only 2 ropes running out to my boom. On small boats like ours, you really don't need all that much help to pull in the main sail. The problem is that the mass of rope that we put up to make it easy can be a hindrance. Not only is it more stuff to tangle, but in light air, it really makes your mainsail unable to respond to a small breeze, the friction of the blocks is too much”.
yep! too much of the yellow rope!
Lets take it down to only 2 not 4 and see what difference that makes?
I really appreciate Jon giving up his time. I have no idea where in the states he resides but it was kind to pass on the tips and advice.......so thanks Jon.....and if any navigator owners can steer me correctly on the business with the boom adjustments......I’d really appreciate it. I know people have given me advice in the past but I’m still confused. As a teacher I know that sometimes you have to tell or show some students the same things several times before they internalise it....and this is OK with me, for once they get it, they fly! I am one of these ‘late’ flyers!
Steve
I hesitate to comment Steve, because my main is a gaff, but you've got me wondering!
ReplyDeleteFirst, Johns plan as I read it specifies hanging the boom outhaul on a fixed saddle on the mast. Yours seems to have drooped on the rope lashings on the mast. I wonder if your boom is too low? That outhaul is the easiest way to pull the boom sternwards, and in pulling back it will flatten the sail in the horizontal direction.
Without then pulling the halyard or the downhaul, or probably both, you'll create a horizontal crease in the sail, or the sort of looseness that seems to have occurred in that video. The halyard and downhauls will tension the sail in the vertical direction, pulling out that crease.
Without the outhaul you'd have a vertical crease I think.
So first I'd look at the height and fixing of the outhaul (the silver blocks with red/white line) and maybe fix them to the mast 1200mm from the base of the mast. John also specifies other lines and adjustments there.
I also wonder whether the downhaul at the foot is maybe too far aft? There seems to be a big gap between the mast and the sail- but this could just be because the downhaul is too loose....I'll have another look at the vid.
I had to figure out all the practicalities of mine sitting in the boat on the trailer on a calm day, just seeing what happened when... (because it's easy not to see things when you're sailing a boat!)
Like I said- these are observations of a non-sprit-sailor! Cheers,
Rob
sorry, me again again...
ReplyDeletejust also noticed that your boom is set on the same side of the mast as the sail. It should be on the opposite side I think.
Hi Steve, thanks so much for your words of wisdom. I am pretty much the same boat (sorry) in that I am about to complete my own Navigator (after just over 4 years) and will soon be learning to sail. Hence I am learning heaps through your posts. You seem to be having lots of fun. Which is what it is all about I guess. Cheers, Jim.
ReplyDeleteJim, hi and thanks for kind words. Rob, as always pearls of wisdom, some I sort of knew and some I'd forgotten to check. Now the issue is like this. I did have the outhaul on a fixed setting but way back it was suggested I move it to a sliding band which could be adjusted in height - can't remember why....but you are right I had it far too low and didn't spot it.
ReplyDeleteyou are also right about the downhaul being too far aft and also attached to a point within the boat. I sort of followed Barrett's construction of Yuko for a time which had the downhaul like this. This was partly because I made my coamings at the front too high!!! It was also because I had no idea what I was doing and her photos helped enormously. In addition, I discovered and don't ask me how this happened because I have no idea, but the mast is 12cm too short! The mast band has also slipped down, having worn away the little ledge it was sat on and there isn't enough mast thickness to make a new ledge. Consequently you can see that the sail is thus about 20 - 30 cm lower than it should be....which forced me to put the downhaul inside the boat!!!!!!!!!!!! If you look carefully at the deck of Arwen, you will see holes in it where I tried running the downhaul through those but it still didn't work very well. When I pulled hard the sail hit the deck and still wasn't tensioned fully or correctly. I sort of went for better to have lots of tension but sail slightly aft than poor tension but sail hitting deck!
Normally I get a better sail position than this and that's seen on other videos. On this day, for some obscure reason, I didn't spot the lower boom position; I tightened the outhaul a little too much and you are right I didn't spot that the sail and boom were on the same side
Incompetency which is why so few people sail with me!
If you have any suggestions as to how I can fix the mast issue - I'd love to hear them because I'm at a complete loss on that one. Similarly, sort me out on what I'm supposed to do with the mizzen when tacking Rob, because I'm still confused about that as well
It's a miracle I ever sailed 25 miles to salcombe and then back again last summer isn't it!
Jim, take note because the advice from Rob is always well considered and outstanding
cheers
steve
Steve- don't be so hard on yourself, you've done fantastic things in wonderful places and we all have been the beneficiaries of your going to the trouble of sharing the triumphs and with incredible honesty, the challenges. It is fabulous!
ReplyDeleteI'd be tempted to find a way of getting that extra length for the mast though, either by raising the step 120mm if you can reach in there to epoxy a higher one pre-fabbed before fitting, or maybe a new step at seat height with some support under.
The extra height will make for easier sail shape adjustments which will give you better control and also make it SO much more comfortable when tacking (without endangering your head). I'm sure that a flatter bottom half of your main would make tacking easier too.
Fixing the mast height makes the other adjustments - beads and downhaul- easier to re-set.
I noticed your recent tacking issue was without the jib. The absence of the jib just makes the mizzen more powerful relative to the balance of the rig, so timing its release would be more crucial too.
I like to think of the rig as balancing or pivoting on the main with the jib and mizzen acting as opposing forces at either end. So sitting on a starboard tack for example, the jib will want to pull the bow to port but the mizzen will be trying to pull the stern to port too...but the boat will want to pivot from a middle point, so the sail that's sheeted in hardest will win- ie loosen the jib and the mizzen will swing the bow to starboard (or into the wind) which is what you want it to do at the start of a tack.
But as soon as you are head to wind that mizzen will hold you there because it is the sail acting behind the balance point of the boat. So as soon as you are head to wind the mizzen is released and it looses all power, thus powering up the jib which will get you past the wind. In average conditions you don't need to do anything to the main while tacking. Just cleat it off and let the two outside sails do the levering, rather like a see-saw.
Powering up the mizzen by easing the jib feels like the tiller is pulling away from you (ie wanting to tack). That is weather helm.
Powering up the jib by releasing the mizzen feels like the tiller is getting lighter and the boat wants to bear away from the wind. That is lee helm- and if you let go of the tiller the boat will go away from the wind and probably faster.
That's why finding a bit of weather helm feels safer, because if you let go the boat will de-power a bit because it rounds up into the wind. A sort of default safety setting.
The mizzen and jib are always competing to get the upper hand, and I find that (while learning) it is easiest in average conditions to adjust the feel of the helm with the jib sheets, only touching the mizzen sheet when tacking or jybing (or, obviously letting it out for running before the wind).
Hope some of this makes sense,
Rob
I think that this is the most erudite, clear and simple explanation I've read....and I've been waiting so long for someone to explain it in a way in which I can then draw mental pictures in my mind (i'm a visual/kinasethetic learner...for those wanting to know). I now need to sketch it out and annotate it so I internalise what is being said.
ReplyDeleteRob, in case I forgot to say last time, you and Jon - star's! thank you!
steve